Read the chapter on Feedback in Robert Duke’s Intelligent Music Teaching: Please post 1 blog post by midnight on 3/4 and 2 discussion posts on our Student Teaching Blog by midnight on 3/6 about an idea you found particularly interesting or helpful.
I enjoyed reading this chapter. Feedback is very important in teaching a lesson whether positive or negative. A teacher needs to give both positive and negative feedback. If one gives too much positive and no negative, then the student will overlook the problems since everything seems to be good. If there is too much negative and not enough positive, then the student can become very discouraged. We as teachers need to find a balance of when to use both. I was instructed at Suzuki Violin School this summer in the ECC (Every Child Can) class, that we need to be positive while being negative. For example instead of saying, "Wow, that was great, but you missed some notes here," we could say "Wow, you played that piece very well." "Now let's work on these 5 notes." The last example in my experience has been a much more effective way to give feedback in a lesson.
It is amazing what impact our words can have on our students. If we as teachers give our feedback one way, the student can get discouraged or bored, and if we give our feedback another way, the student will be motivated to continue working hard. James 3 talks about the power of a tongue. James likens it to a rudder on a ship. Although the rudder is a small part of the ship, it directs the course of the ship. The tongue is like the rudder. When we as teachers use our tongues to give the right feedback, whether positive or negative, we can impact our students' lives.
I found Duke's discussion on directing feedback very interesting. Duke said that teachers can control feedback by "controlling the opportunities to give feedback." Sequencing and feedback go hand-in-hand. When a teacher structures the lesson in easy, small tasks that are capable for the student to do well, then the teacher is controlling the positive and negative feedback given to the students. I like what Duke said at the conclusion to this section. "Want to give a kid some positive feedback as he's working to improve his rhythmic precision? Don't tell him you like his shoes. Don't tell him you think he's sitting with good posture, even though that may be true. Set him up to perform a task in which he is likely to demonstrate rhythmic precision and thereby create an opportunity for the student to perform accurately and receive positive feedback not only from you, but also from his classmates and , most importantly, from his perception of his own accomplishment."
I really liked your comments! It is amazing (and overwhelming) how much of our students' learning falls back on us! First we have to see what needs to be fixed, then we have to plan ahead of the lesson to know how we are going to address that specific issue. Set them up to succeed so that when they do you don't need to say "I like your shoes!" but you can instead say "you did what I asked with great rhythmic precision!" (not that we would actually use those words with smaller children :)). When we do this we are enabling correct response, enforcing correct response, and avoiding reinforcement of bad habits.
This was an interesting chapter. Duke spent a lot of time at the beginning of the chapter describing how powerful feedback can be. He makes a good case for why feedback needs to be intentional. I also thought Duke’s idea of controlling positive and negative feedback was very helpful. It seems like it is easy for teachers to get upset with students who constantly fail a task instead of giving the student tasks they can perform already (and merit positive feedback). This concept ties back to “starting from scratch every time.” I hope that there would always be plenty to praise a student for if they demonstrated fundamentals every week.
I saw that this chapter tied in with the sequencing chapter, but it also goes back to why teachers should start from scratch every time. When the teacher starts "from scratch every time", the teacher is directing the student's task so that the teacher can give positive feedback.
Good thoughts! I find that it is very difficult to find the balance of tasks that are too easy for the student and tasks that are unbearably difficult. I think the task needs to not be too challenging for the student to be able to accomplish in a reasonable amount of attempt, but just challenging enough that it is a fun 'task' or puzzle to solve. How else are they supposed to get better? This thought occurred to me as I was reading Duke's illustration with the video games. We can make the 'game' too easy or hard, but I think that, like all video games, they should have to come across some challenging spots where they have to 'die' and restart the level. I hope that made sense..it didn't come out well in words.
I agree with you in that it is difficult to always maintain a positive attitude when students do not understand different concepts. It should be an indication to us that we need to start from scratch. I was challenged also to not give looks, or even yell with my hands.
Wow. This was a really powerful chapter. I fully expect to change my teaching because of it and can’t wait for the discussion on Thursday! It is so hard to decide what to include in this post so I will briefly touch on a few things that hit me. The first thing that became very obvious to me was the importance of feedback. A teacher’s response to it is what separates a good teacher from a poor one. Lessons will become static and frustrating if the teacher cannot see that the student doesn’t understand or cannot perform the task required. Once a teacher learns to read and react to those little nuggets of lesson changing responses, he or she can correctly guide that student to success and encouragement. It is really scary to think that we are the ones who set the student up to succeed or to fail by how hard or boringly easy we make the task. The other concept that was especially good for me was a wrong decision is not punished, it is corrected. The text doesn’t clearly say those words, but the thought struck me as I was reading. Too often I see a wrong behavior and get my scolding “teacher look” instead of simply saying “that is not the right way to behave, this is.” This is something I can say with a smile on my face instead of a scowl. I need to learn to use correction in the place of punishment (which can take many forms - for instance, loss of reward). Also I need to learn how to set up the assignment so that the student can succeed (which will most likely keep me from having to correct bad behavior). In order to set up the assignment I need to understand what the problem is and how to fix it. That seems obvious, but it is not as easy as it sounds.
I also liked the idea that a concept is not punished but corrected. I think it is very important for teachers to keep that in the front of our minds when we are teaching.
I enjoyed reading this chapter. Feedback is very important in teaching a lesson whether positive or negative. A teacher needs to give both positive and negative feedback. If one gives too much positive and no negative, then the student will overlook the problems since everything seems to be good. If there is too much negative and not enough positive, then the student can become very discouraged. We as teachers need to find a balance of when to use both. I was instructed at Suzuki Violin School this summer in the ECC (Every Child Can) class, that we need to be positive while being negative. For example instead of saying, "Wow, that was great, but you missed some notes here," we could say "Wow, you played that piece very well." "Now let's work on these 5 notes." The last example in my experience has been a much more effective way to give feedback in a lesson.
ReplyDeleteIt is amazing what impact our words can have on our students. If we as teachers give our feedback one way, the student can get discouraged or bored, and if we give our feedback another way, the student will be motivated to continue working hard. James 3 talks about the power of a tongue. James likens it to a rudder on a ship. Although the rudder is a small part of the ship, it directs the course of the ship. The tongue is like the rudder. When we as teachers use our tongues to give the right feedback, whether positive or negative, we can impact our students' lives.
DeleteI found Duke's discussion on directing feedback very interesting. Duke said that teachers can control feedback by "controlling the opportunities to give feedback." Sequencing and feedback go hand-in-hand. When a teacher structures the lesson in easy, small tasks that are capable for the student to do well, then the teacher is controlling the positive and negative feedback given to the students. I like what Duke said at the conclusion to this section. "Want to give a kid some positive feedback as he's working to improve his rhythmic precision? Don't tell him you like his shoes. Don't tell him you think he's sitting with good posture, even though that may be true. Set him up to perform a task in which he is likely to demonstrate rhythmic precision and thereby create an opportunity for the student to perform accurately and receive positive feedback not only from you, but also from his classmates and , most importantly, from his perception of his own accomplishment."
ReplyDeleteI really liked your comments! It is amazing (and overwhelming) how much of our students' learning falls back on us! First we have to see what needs to be fixed, then we have to plan ahead of the lesson to know how we are going to address that specific issue. Set them up to succeed so that when they do you don't need to say "I like your shoes!" but you can instead say "you did what I asked with great rhythmic precision!" (not that we would actually use those words with smaller children :)). When we do this we are enabling correct response, enforcing correct response, and avoiding reinforcement of bad habits.
DeleteThis was an interesting chapter. Duke spent a lot of time at the beginning of the chapter describing how powerful feedback can be. He makes a good case for why feedback needs to be intentional. I also thought Duke’s idea of controlling positive and negative feedback was very helpful. It seems like it is easy for teachers to get upset with students who constantly fail a task instead of giving the student tasks they can perform already (and merit positive feedback). This concept ties back to “starting from scratch every time.” I hope that there would always be plenty to praise a student for if they demonstrated fundamentals every week.
ReplyDeleteI saw that this chapter tied in with the sequencing chapter, but it also goes back to why teachers should start from scratch every time. When the teacher starts "from scratch every time", the teacher is directing the student's task so that the teacher can give positive feedback.
DeleteGood thoughts! I find that it is very difficult to find the balance of tasks that are too easy for the student and tasks that are unbearably difficult. I think the task needs to not be too challenging for the student to be able to accomplish in a reasonable amount of attempt, but just challenging enough that it is a fun 'task' or puzzle to solve. How else are they supposed to get better? This thought occurred to me as I was reading Duke's illustration with the video games. We can make the 'game' too easy or hard, but I think that, like all video games, they should have to come across some challenging spots where they have to 'die' and restart the level. I hope that made sense..it didn't come out well in words.
DeleteI agree with you in that it is difficult to always maintain a positive attitude when students do not understand different concepts. It should be an indication to us that we need to start from scratch. I was challenged also to not give looks, or even yell with my hands.
DeleteWow. This was a really powerful chapter. I fully expect to change my teaching because of it and can’t wait for the discussion on Thursday! It is so hard to decide what to include in this post so I will briefly touch on a few things that hit me. The first thing that became very obvious to me was the importance of feedback. A teacher’s response to it is what separates a good teacher from a poor one. Lessons will become static and frustrating if the teacher cannot see that the student doesn’t understand or cannot perform the task required. Once a teacher learns to read and react to those little nuggets of lesson changing responses, he or she can correctly guide that student to success and encouragement. It is really scary to think that we are the ones who set the student up to succeed or to fail by how hard or boringly easy we make the task. The other concept that was especially good for me was a wrong decision is not punished, it is corrected. The text doesn’t clearly say those words, but the thought struck me as I was reading. Too often I see a wrong behavior and get my scolding “teacher look” instead of simply saying “that is not the right way to behave, this is.” This is something I can say with a smile on my face instead of a scowl. I need to learn to use correction in the place of punishment (which can take many forms - for instance, loss of reward). Also I need to learn how to set up the assignment so that the student can succeed (which will most likely keep me from having to correct bad behavior). In order to set up the assignment I need to understand what the problem is and how to fix it. That seems obvious, but it is not as easy as it sounds.
ReplyDeleteI also liked the idea that a concept is not punished but corrected. I think it is very important for teachers to keep that in the front of our minds when we are teaching.
ReplyDelete